sarah_mck
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 00:34
also -in regards to numbers...
If there's potenitally goint to be 3 teams at nationals (~3X15), then there should be enough for ~5 teams of like 8-10 for league shouldn't there?
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savvy_nat
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 09:20
Back to the original point - why should people be bothered to play a women’s league (with women who have any experience playing ultimate?)
1. Competing in a women’s league will increase your skills.
2. It’s a women’s league - its something different and will develop your skills greatly. There are no guys to rely on. The game is different.
3. It will be fun - let’s re-create a healthy community amongst Ultimate women here in WA. It will make us better players and make it more enjoyable. Playing in a supportive environment is much more encouraging.
Let us not forget that every experienced player had the opportunity to become experienced. It didn’t just happen overnight. For me, Joelle, Anna and Lenny told me to keep coming to Nationals training even though I had no intention of going because I’d played a few Monday nights at Murdoch. If they had’ve told me I wasn’t welcome, I wouldn’t have kept going, I wouldn't have gone to Nationals in Melbourne,and had an awesome time, and I wouldn’t be playing today.
So - if you are willing to turn people away who just may not have the experience level that you would ideally like, then please, don’t bother playing.
Can I also remind you - when Primal didn’t win our Western Regional’s this year, many of the other team hadn’t had much experience, yet it was still a competitive game and they ended up beating us. Why? Because a few individuals actually helped out the less experienced players and worked together. So you can still get a competitive league happening. Of course it won’t be at National’s level - WA doesn’t have that depth - but who knows, one day we might. If only we were encouraging others….
So - why should you be bothered to play - it’ll be good competition, its only women - which is great fun, you will develop your skills and become a better player, and help our Ultimate community to grow.
Stop thinking how it will be a hindrance to you and start thinking about how you can help yourself to be a better player.
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deb_ng
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 09:57
I do agree that the Premier League should be played at a "PUL" level, those who's trained with me probably know I'm not the most patient person with beginner's.
Mac makes a good point that October is not the ideal time for a development league being so close to training season, and this timing issue is something WAFDA should keep in mind for future planning.
Since this has been advertised as a "Premier League" (with or without the word elite thrown around), I'd assume many new players (e.g. 1-2 SUL's) would be deterred from registering. This is a good thing in my view, this shows the girls who've registered REALLY want to play women's and REALLY want to improve. Judging from the registered roster so far, add another couple of girls, this WILL be a competitive league of 3 teams. However, should these couple of girls be from a SUL team, would we turn them away? If there is a sudden spike in interest from SUL players, we should limit the amount in the Premier League - IF there are already sufficient numbers for a competitive league, perhaps through a draft/selection system like the men's but with our own set of criteria.
Another good point you made Mac - WHY is there not 45 women registered to play when we're proposing to have THREE women's nationals teams??? Are they hiding under a rock? commitment-phobic? MIA? The issue of numbers seem to happen EVERY women's league that I've run and EVERY Nationals that I've played, there seems to be tonnes of women (last count approx. 60+) at Wednesday leagues but as soon as its nationals training season or women's league season, 80% of them disappear into thin air...
Now its up to the girls who've signed up to make sure they turn up to EVERY game (at least let the director know when you're not available) so we don't end up playing 5 on 5 because you forgot you'll be away or you didn't feel like playing. The fact that this discussion thread is active shows WA women want women's ultimate.
Time to commit and focus ladies!
ps. This forum has been active for 2 years, members should take some time to explore the website that has taken numerous VOLUNTEER hours to create.
pps. Players who choose to stay away from the forum can not expect to be heard - whatever the reason for staying away, you are only doing yourself a disservice.
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Lou
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 10:05
i completely agree.
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sarah_mck
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 10:28
Original post/request for comment:
Now that WAFDA is prepping to put a bid in to host Nationals 2009, the committee is seriously considering starting a premier league to cultivate elite Ultimate. Major questions for members:
1. When? Another weeknight besides Wed? Sunday morning? Sunday arvo?
I think weeknight and weekly comp.
2. League or Tournament structure? Play in a weekly league or play a half day tourney every few weeks?
I like day tournis when there's enough teams to play multiple games an diff teams each week/month..not sure WA is at that size. Also, if it's given a proportion of the wa women are students, they have causal jobs which prob makes committing to weekends harder..this may go the same for Thursday nights, not sure? Also...if the league is to be serious/competitive, might be an idea to minimise the # of ppl playing with hangovers  Hence, weeknights.
3. Club or Hat teams? How should teams be selected? Club teams who train together to field a team or should teams be evened out via a draft system?
I think drafted teams that have a relatively even distribution of strength and weaknesses..no stacking of teams. Although it's fun to play with your friends & I would love to play with my firends, it is good to play with different people..WA commnuity is not massive I'm sure ppl will all know some of the people on their team.
This feedback from the Ultimate population will help the committee determine how best to run this elite competition - what would gather most support & commitment from players to make this venture effective and sustainable.
Like I said in a previous post, I think there are 2 focuses to make wa womens frisbee sustainable: 1)increasing population size/developing novice players and 2)extending the depth/skill level of our core intermediate players.
I think the october league needs to be focused on the latter and is not an ideal time to introduce novice players...bring them to SUL, still introduce them to ultimate, encourage them to come watch etc. but in my opinion WA womens frisbee has taken a step up from this time last yr and in terms of nationals, we can really take a step up byt extending the intermediate players. I think this league should be for competitive and intermediate to strong/experienced players only. (i don't think the word elite is applicable, but yes, stronger players only)
This Premier League should indeed be played at an elite level.(...I'd say competitive and challenging, but yes with WA's 'elite' players). Whether it be Club or Hat teams, each team should train and seek to improve in order to maintain an elite level of play as you would at Nationals.
Issues: Is there enough support and commitment out there to make a Women's Premier League happen?
If all those who've expressed interest in nationals (potentially enough for 3 teams) jump on bboard we should be able to have 4-5 teams of 8-10 players right? I'm thinking previous nationals players, those that've trained for unigames over past 4-6 months and those that have played SEVERAL PUL leagues.
There are currently 60 women playing in the Wed night leagues but there was very little interest in the recent Women's league - why is this so?
I've been away so I'm not sure if this was the womens league last summer or not? I think the number of intermediate players has increased since then, yes due to nationals and getting more ppl on board...i think this is now the time to take this group of players and extend their skills more.
I think post-nationals is the time for another beginner/less experienced player recruitment and development league.
Ladies - please tell the committee what would increase (or what is hindering) the interest & commitment to Women's Ultimate both at a development & elite level.
Think I've said my point -given we're approaching our nationals campaign I think a competitive league without novice players...think of it as encouraging all those intermediate players to get involved with nationals. And encourage stronger players to help develop these intermediate players. Make it challenging.
I like competitive sport so I enjoy it when it is a challenge!
If Perth is to host Nationals 2009, WA women have a fantastic opportunity to put their best foot forward. However, the focus is very much on WA women's Ultimate development in general. As enthusiasm & commitment to it grows, fielding competitive teams at any National tournament would simply be the by-product of this growth.
I think we can take a step up from the previous few years and stengthen/develop the intermediate players we already have.
That's my views, as requested.
I will continue to bother playing because I think I have lots more to improve on and opporunities to share what i ddo know with others.
I just don't think this league is the most appropriate time to introduce more beginners. I think we need to make the intermediate players better in time for a solid nationals campaign -regardless of how many teams wa enter, and who plays for who.
This will give beginners someting to aspite to...and come post nats, more stronger players to help out developing the newbies in time for nationals 2010. (There are also WUCC in 2010....would be cool if we had some WA representation in this...so I think preparation needds to start now!) .
[b]I was fortunate to attend the Brisbane development camp earlier this year. WA are not out of contention with the rest of Australian women, but we don't have the same opportunities to experience playing with elite women like other states. This was a great opportunity and showed that with a little further development, then WA women have the potential to be on the same par with the other core 'intermediate/strong' players in the country that attended this camp.
Time to speak up ladies![/b]
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sarah_mck
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Re:Women's Premier League? - 2008/09/23 10:36
In regards to Deb's email...
I agree. I think that those who've already registered show their committment to wanting to improve and streth WA's depth.
Of course we wouldn't turn away one or two SUL players..particularly if they're spread out and are the reason we can have enough teams. but I don't think it's the time them really.
In my view nationals should be a competiticve committment. I would ideally like to play on a team that is with strong players, of course there'll still be a range of skill and everyone will have their strengths & weaknesses ...thats what makes up depth in teams a range of strengths and the ability to share and develop each others games. However, everyone needs that same play hard committment all the time.
I guess this is the reason we're having numerous teams for 2009 because not everyone shares this view and some want to use nationals as an opportunity to develop/encouage novice and less athletic players etc.
I just don't think nationals is the time or the place for this, given that the depth and number or wa women has improved significantly over the past couple of years..lets go forward with a new goal.
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